LETTER: It’s time to let your child decide

Amen! Excellent oped. My son joined the Army out of high school and has never regretted it - free housing, health care, etc. He even received a $20,000 bonus for reenlisting. There are many avenues for advancement and a career.

Perhaps because the parents do not want their children killed in a war based on lies and selective intellegence.

I for one do not feel any safer because our sons and daughters are fighting in Iraq. In fact I feel less secure as we are now seen as invaders.

If you "knew he would be fine knowing he had great training" why then were you and your husband scared?

We have lost 4000 lives for what? AND our troops in Afganistan are facing a resurgent Taliban while we prop up a dream of Democracy in Iraq. Osamba Bin Laden is still living and our sons and daughters are dying. Maybe parents don't see the need to sacrifice their children's lives for some President's vendetta.

Before I let my child decide to sign on to a military career, I think he should be able to walk into a bar and have a beer.

Why are they capable of making the decision to sign on for military service but not capable of ordering a beer?

Parents step back? You mean the people that gave birth to the kid? How about recruiters step back?
It is good that communications are better today. You can find out almost instantly when your teenage son gets eviscerated by a suicide bomber. How comforting.
Who'd you pray to? Do you not think that those that had kids blown to bits prayed too? Wow.
HQ: 9.25.

The thing I most admire of the military is the fact that it makes one into a man. After graduating college, however, I've always had a question with sense of duty.

Maybe the informed group of people here can help illuminate my curiousity. There are many troops that say they disagree with the war and believe it is causing more backlash than positive effects. The troops still say, although they disagree, they still must do what they are told.

This has reminded me for the last 6-7 years of "rallying behind the great leader," except 3 out of 4 people at the dinner table can't wait for him to be out of office. The question is how can we just blindly follow directions, while America believes it is heading in the wrong direction. Does the government serve us or do the people serve the government. (Look at Rove not even answering his subpoena).

I am totally shocked by some of the comments posted each day by some people.

I served in the U.S. Navy and I am proud of it. And it was during a time when the USA nearly went to war with Russia over the events in Cuba. And the Vietnam War was breaking out. Regardless, out of it I was very very fortunate to go to college and graduate on the G.W. Educational Bill.

We went to war in Afganistan and Iraq based on intelligence info that was not
100% accurate...but accurate enough that both Republicans and Democrats voted to go to war. And several others countries in the world thought to be correct. And we went to war because nearly 3,000 innocent Americans were killed in New York City, WashDC and the field of Pennsy.

And...yes...it has cost of the lives of about 4,000 young American military people....which is extremely SAD. Yet, if you interview (which has been done) a large cross section of American military personnel in Iraqi or Afganistan...the vast majority of them will tell you "the USA has done the right thing...and we have freed millions of people in the those two countries, and are bring them a better way of life."

No doubt...war is a terrible thing...and yes people get killed, etc., kids joining the military today are NOT dumb they done the danger; yet still join.

If we (the USA) does not but sit out our butts (as SamLam suggests)and practice isolationism....Russia would still control all of Eastern Europe, and perhaps Nazi Germany would control all of Western Europe, etc. Wars are ugly and killers of young people.....no doubt...but the alternative is much much much worse.

Each year approximately 48,000 Americans are killed in auto accidents, and a huge percent because of drinking and driving....yet....there is hardly a whimper when the annual auto death tolls are announced. Perhaps, SamLam, if you want to champion a cause at which you are correct it would the annual auto death toll....because you are totally wrong about Iraqi/Afganistan.

And yes....even today...I would join the military (again) if I were young enough.....FREEDOM IS NOT FREE!!

Aaaah...but no fear...your hero Barack Hussein Obama is going to save us all...
that is "if" he can stop flip-flopping and decide where he REALLY understands on the war on terrorism. I am so very very confident that after Commander in Chief Obama and everyone's hero Chuck Hagel return from Iraq....we will have all the answers....or at least answers for that particular day...and Obama's answers will change 4 or 5 times more before the November elections.

Joe S.-- To quote your post "We went to war in Afganistan and Iraq based on intelligence info that was not
100% accurate...but accurate enough that both Republicans and Democrats voted to go to war. And several others countries in the world thought to be correct. And we went to war because nearly 3,000 innocent Americans were killed in New York City, WashDC and the field of Pennsy."

My response... Not 100% accurate? Try completely false. I welcome you to do a Google search of the Phase II intelligence report that was released on June 5, 2008. It clearly shows that our current administration lied to America and the World in their speculation of WMD in Iraq in an attempt at fear mongering to bring us into this war on Iraq. As for the 9/11 deaths, Iraq had nothing to do with these terroristic attacks. These were the work of Al Qaida that is based in Afghanistan, not Iraq.

As for the issue of sending our children into the military, I agree it should be a choice each young adult makes. But I also feel parents have every right to voice their concerns and fears to their children. If this deters them from entering the service that is their choice. It is not the job of Ms. Wesemann to guilt parents on their feelings and concerns over their child’s safety. Every parent is entitled to these feelings and nobody has the right to belittle or judge them for it.

It is interesting how often people who criticize Obama must include his middle name Hussein as if it were anything more than a middle name. I love it. Good luck to you in a changing world.

I agree that sometimes the military is good for a person however it can be very bad for you if you end up getting killed. Come on people think, why would a parent be against a child going to the military? Well maybe they don't believe that war is worth the possible death of their child. Get a brain.

I, for one, don't think that most 17-18 year olds are really ready to make a mature decision. They quite frankly make a lot of really stupid ones. They are not all that mature for a few more years yet. We don't even trust teens to drive with other teens in the car until AT LEAST 17, because of the poor decisions that they make.

As far as parents steering (forcing) their kids to a certain area after high school, this is not a new thing. Some kids are forced into the military, some college, some trade school. Some are strongly encouraged (forced) to follow in the family business footsteps.

I am not saying that parents should be keeping their child from joining the military, but that is a decision that is very personal to each family. The parent knows their child best, knows what they can and can't handle, and the parent knows a lot better what is 'out there' than does their child.

Also-I had persistant recruiters on my tail in high school, and 'my parents won't let me' might just be an excuse to get your kid to leave them alone. Recruiters have been trained like telemarketers to have a rebuttal for any objection, but 'mom says no' is harder to overcome.

maybe their parents dont want them to die and never come home

First off, at the age of majority in any state, a "child" can choose to do whatever they want against a parents wishes or not, so ultimately they do get to make their own choice.

However, I encourage or discourage my children to do things or a daily basis, that doesn't stop because of a number. As a parent it is my job to do so, based on my life experiences and knowledge.

What is more appaling, a parent who offers up advice and wisdom to do what they feel is best for their child - having known this child for life and presumably knowing their weaknesses and strengths - or a recruiter (who knows nothing about that child) who uses tactics that can in some situations lead to turmoil in a family?

i served for four years in the navy in the vietnam era. i will still say ,as i have always said,this country needs to bring back the draft. i think everyone needs to go into the military. it will either make a man/woman out of them or kill them in boot camp. i also will say, and i am sure i will catch flak for this, although i did go into the military and go to vietnam, i would never do it again and i would not want anyone else to go to a war like vietnam or iraq or afganistan. these are all political and self improvement wars. by that i mean that certain people make a fortune on wars. like bush and cheney for instance. this country needs to stop sticking their nose into everyone elses business and take care of our own first. my son went into the air force. before he joined i told him i would drive him to canada myself if he was drafted. i did not want him to go to a war just so some morons can make money off it. he then went and joined the air force and went to school and made a great life for himself. he said exactly what i now say about he was glad he did it but would never do it again. every kid needs to go to boot camp and come out a man or end up in trouble. not all kids are bad if they didnt make it in boot camp, but it would be great if we could get these punks, trouble makers off the streets and teach them to grow up and make something of themselves. i have the highest regard for anyone who goes into the military. that shows me that they know what commitment and responsibility is. i always shake their hands and tell them thanks. and i also tell them "keep your head down, and your mouth shut and be safe". even though i do not support the reasons we are in a war, i do most definitly support the troops, navy personnel, men and women who serve and do their part. that also gives them the right to talk about the wars and what we need to do about the wars. please everyone, support our people in the military.

To start with I am totally against the war in Iraq but I am for our young men and women serving in the military. I beleive that as they do in many countries the USA should have a mandatory 2 years of service to your country after high school. The service teaches them many life skills and discipline needed to succeec in life also it teaches love of country, respect and much more ,something the young people in the USA have forgotten or take for granted. My son is career army and I am proud of him. His entry to the army was his choice, his senior year of high school. We gave him many options of what he could do with his life and he chose the army. He has gone many places, made lifelong friends and has served his country well. When he retires he will be young enough to start a whole new career. He has this leg up on most, because he has had so many life experiences. So those of you who put down those who chose the military look deep into yourself. What have you done with your life that you, your family and your country can be proud of?

to nancy: AMEN AMEN AMEN
YOU HIT THE NAIL RIGHT ON THE HEAD. THANK YOU AND THANKS TO YOUR SON FOR SERVING.

Whats appalling is that THIS country can NEVER agree...
First off LSB do you really believe everything you read on the internet? The phase 2 documents? By now im sure we all have figured out we get exactly the information the Govt wants us to.. Second...I have a cousin who fights for our interests...I KNOW he is there doing the right thing...so you people sitting back all comfy in your house looking down your noses at our soldiers should maybe get a flight to the middle east and take a LONG look around....We are there now because we will be there sonner or later...We have very few allies and MANY MANY enemies that would love for nothing more than for the USA to fall on its face.. I agree the parents that steer there kids away from the service need to remember there parents didnt get to decide the draft told them they were going to Europe...Perhaps the draft should be put back in place ... i dont know....What i do know is that the business will hit the fan again real soon...and its going to be a Country Wide effort to sustain our way of life...Im proud of each and every serviceman God Bless You All!!!

I served my country with pride and honor. I hate reading posts from experts who never served their country and have no plans to ever be in the military.
A a veteran, I feel my experience in the service counts for something.
So, here are my thoughts:
1. We should all want to serve our country and proetect it and our democracy.
2. Staging a foolish war in Iraq, based on falsehoods and lies, has cost our country many valued service members. The greatest benefit to this war was Dick Cheney's Halliburton and other "no bid" defense contractors who have sucked our nations finances dry. Now we are borrowing money from china to finance a war! Notice how many experts there are on the military??? Ask them one question -- when did you serve?
2. My brother has served three tours in Iraq. he is in combat. He enlisted. He is doing it because it is his job and his assigned mission. Does he want to get shot at daily? NO. Does he feel our presence is right? NO! Does he feel we will win anything from this debacle? NO.
But he is following orders and doing the best job he can for his country.
3. When politicians and their families and experts fight the wars, things will change . . . there will not be any more wars.

I am very proud of my brother and all enlistees. They have chosen a career and following their orders. IS it fun?NO. Would they rather not be there? YES. But they will finish their assignments with honor as I also finished mine.

to proud veteran:
i agree with you totally. send these moron politicians and their kids to war and see how fast we are no longer involved. i have said that bush and his spoiled rotten kids andd wife should get into uniforms, given guns, and taken to iraq or afganistan and turned loose. can you or i imagine how fast we would be pulled out of those countries? so fast that we wouldnt even see it comming. god forbid that bush or cheney or their precious family mambers should dirty themselves defending the country they are fleecing thru oil and other means.

former fremonter-- No, I don't believe everything I read on the internet, but actually government sites that are posting public information I do believe. Do you really believe the government wants to release information that proves we are in a war because of lies? Why do you think it has been so hush hush and not made headlines on the news? If you don't want to believe the facts of the war that is your issue. Hiding your head in the sand and refusing to even read the facts will only keep you in the dark.
As for sitting on my couch looking down my nose, my cousin was a Marine killed in Fallujah Iraq. He was only 21 and had his whole life in front of him. I come from a family of military men and I did encourage my daughter to join the service when she was 18 but it was her decision not to. My father and uncles did many tours in Vietnam, my grandfather fought in WWII and my brother was in Desert Storm. I have never looked down at our troops. The fact that I do not agree with this war does not mean I do not support our troops and pray for the safety of each and every one of them. But thanks for the assumption that everyone against the war is also against the military and our troops.

I think wheter we like it or not we are stuck in a war. That's just the truth of the matter. I think people who make the decison to join the military should be commended and supported not matter what we think of the war. They have chosen to do what they can to help all of us. I also think that parents have every right to be afraid of their children joining and should have every right to voice that fear. I do not think an 18 year old can make an informed decision without hearing their parents. If after that they want to join then their parents should support them.

My daughter joined the military before she even graduated high school and 2 days after she graduated, left for basic training. I helped push her into this decision and will never regret that. She has been in the Army now for over a year and been promoted twice and is currently serving over in Germany. I pray for her (and all the other soldiers) everyday that they will all come back even though I know in my heart that there will be casualities (that is part of life). I am very proud of her and of all the soldiers that defend our country. I don't know alot about the political end of it but I do know that no matter how much we don't like it (war) that it's going to happen anyways and yeah, someone is going to make a dollar off it, and yes, we are going to lose some lives but these kids need some structure in their lives. My daughter has become more mature in the past year and more grown-up. I'm unsure of exactly who said it, but there was mention of sending the "hoodlums" to basic training...I couldn't agree more! It will either make them or break them. Either way, it would do them some good rather than overcrowding our prison system and probation office and may even help them realize the dead end road they were traveling.

Just because someone is against the war does not mean they are looking down at soldiers. I really thought we were past that smoke screen. I have nothing against people who are serving our country at all. I have a problem with the war mongering our leaders are doing and with people not being able to see past the end of their nose. Oh and by the way before someone says it. Our military did not GIVE us our freedom. God gives us freedom, our military defends it. Our country is a combination of the Native Americans who were already here and immigrants that came here for freedom. The military is put into place to defend us.

god gives us our freedom? hardy har har.

Ben
I agree with TEX this time around. In our declaration of Indepence from Britian our founding forefathers correctly felt that all men (both genders) were granted unalieable rights of life, liberty, and the PURSUIT of happiness. That means "God" given. Whatever God means to you. Have a good day.

You know, if they want to join they will do it. I followed my brother after he joined. My parents didn't know until I told them. I was 19 and they learned to accept my choice.

Now almost 8 years later my initial contract is almost up. And again it is my choice to re-enlist. This time my choice is different. I will not be re-enlisting.

I understand where parents come from 18 is young...17 is even younger. A lot of these kids don't know where they will be in 8 years. But as long as they follow it through honorably they will learn from the experience, have a sense of pride like no other, and have a greater appreciation for the great country we live in. They will also get to make a choice later on if the want to stay or leave.

My HUSBANDS parents were the kind to say "You WILL NOT join" and he has felt a sense of regret at times since then.

With our children it will be their decision. But I will tell them the pro's and con's as well as have other's tell the pro's and cons. I will tell them the hardships and the things I will never forget because they have helped shape me into who I am.

Would I like them to wait a while to make such a decision. Sure, I was 19 when I made it right or wrong. My brother was 17, right or wrong.

The end result is still the same for us. An experience that so few will ever experience. Friendships that will last a life time. And a better understanding of what this country really is all about. A chance we got because our parents didn't stand in our way but they did educate us on what might someday happen and the difficult times we may face.

American people need to look back at our history. It used to be a requirement for government service to have military experience. Now there are only a few that have any experience other than stepping off a plane in a hot zone. Of course their children don't have it either.

When our government leaders do not stress the importance of service to this country it is no wonder that parents are not stressing the importance of military service for this country.

Guess what, if you don't let your son's and daughter's join....who will?? Who will defend YOU??? Who will defend this nation??? WAR OR NO WAR???

I have at least done my time and have given of my self for this country. Can you say that about you? Can you say that about your child???

If McCaine becomes President, it is just a matter of time before the draft WILL have to be enacted. It will need to be.

I'm just curious how your daughter managed to end up in Germany instead of Iraq or Afganiston - just wondered if others who join the Army are able to go to other countries, or if she just happened to luck out and end up in Germany.

That's right our freedom is a right, all people are meant to be free but in this sick society that has been difficult. But other than Native Americans, the rest of us mostly came here because our ancestors were fleeing, they either were looking for freedom or opportunity. They came over here without a military but created one to protect themselves. The constitution was written to protect our freedoms and it outlined the need for a military for our protection. People had freedom here and it was only after greed became more and more prevalent that the military became more and more prevalent. I say again the military protects our freedom, it did not create it. You want a military state? Think about that for a while, we see it overseas all the time. Not so pretty. I say again, the military did not give us the right to be free, that is pompous and OFF. We have used them to keep it. They are not despite some peoples attitudes to be an independent force, they are here to be used by our country.

I am very surprised after reading all the comments that were left on this great letter by Ms. Wesemann. I never knew how Liberal Fremont was, and it is starting to become embarrassing to say I am from Fremont. Maybe you posters are just giving the rest of us a bad rap. I am a graduate of Archbishop Bergan HS and have been in the Army for three years now and am currently deployed on my 2nd combat tour near Somalia. I am proud of everything that I have ever done in Iraq and will never regret what I CHOSE to do. I want to know who all these people are talking about when they say "our men and women don't want to do it!" Who are you talking about? Are you making things up in your crazy head!? Sure there will be some who do not want to go or are to scared to do his job. A month ago our battalion had asked for volunteers to join our support company currently running convoys in Iraq. Out of 300 or so soldiers, nearly 100% of us had volunteered to go back to Iraq, some for their fourth time. Too bad I was not one of the 10 volunteers selected. If we did not want to do this than we would not have signed up in a TIME OF WAR! Should parents give their children advice on their futures? Yes. Should they make their decisions? NO. How is a person supposed to grow if they are not able to make their own decisions? It was one of the toughest decisions I had ever made, quit college and to join my brothers in arms. I will never regret my decision. I will close with something that I had written in my blog while I was in Iraq nearly three years ago.

A Pointless and Political war is what they call this. Who are they to call what I am doing pointless? These people, the cowards who hide behind the 1st amendment, that people like me stand up and fight for, have no idea what it is like to see the faces of these people that I talk to everyday. The children that I see standing on the sides of the roads smiling and waving, yet at the same time begging for food because their mother and father were denied the God given right to provide for their family. All because a cruel and ruthless dictator kept everything for himself.

They compare this war to Vietnam. How do the two compare? What is the correlation of them? 2306 soldiers dead. 1807 dead from actual hostile action in country. 2306 dead in 3 years, that doesnt even compare to ONE SINGLE MONTH in Vietnam.

What makes these people think that we give a damn about what they have to say? Just because they act on TV or play the guitar in a band, we should be subjected to their rehtoric on a daily basis? How many of them have been out on the roads? Have they seen the way these people have been forced to live the last 30-35 years? How many of them have seeen the death and destruction that I have seen? Personally Ive never heard from any actor or musician asking to go out on the roads to find out first hand what they dont see.

Support the troops but not the war. This is a common phrase now-a-days. Sure I can understand that. Its easy for those who stay back home to say that while I am putting my life on the line constantly. Its not that easy for us, knowing that we are supposed to go home knowing that people hate the good that we've done? How can you hate something that you know nothing about? Something of which you've only experienced through the liberal media who has its own political war waged? A media that doesn't show the Iraqi Army manning its own posts and checkpoints. The Iraqi Police patrolling their own cities and roads. The water pumps that have been built with our help (not built ourselves), so these people can have clean and fresh water. What about the schools that have built? The schools that now give the children the education they deserve. An education that will help out their country in the future. Why don't they know the good? Why wont the media let YOU know the good?

If and when I die here doing what I strongly believe in, when my coffin comes back home with the flag of ours draped, let them come. Let them protest my life. Let them come and sit down inside. Don't let them stay outside where it may be cold, wet, or hot. Let them know that I've fought for, like so many before me, their right to be at my funeral. That I've fought for their right to hate of which they don't understand. Let someone like Cindy Sheehan sit in the front row in the Church. Let her know that Ive be been to where her son had died. That he, like I, gave his life so she can speak out against what she also doesn't know.

I just have one request of them. Please be quite and respectful as my family and friends say goodbye.

I'd be more inclined to allow and even encourage my children to join the service if they were actually standing at our borders defending us, cleaning up our own backyard first, or fighting in a war that really meant protecting the United States, before risking death in a false war.

Don't get me wrong, my heart breaks every time I hear of a service person who dies or is injured. I pray every night that those there are protected from harm and that their families can have some sort of peace in their hearts while they are away. I support the troops (not the war) and hope they get to come home soon. My anger is not directed at them, as they are simply doing what they have been told to do.

But if my son and/or daughter is going to risk their life I want it to actually be for the protection of the USA first; not for some idiotic Presidential vendetta. It is not the job of the United States military to play world police and bully others into our way of thinking and living. It is their job to protect us. Maybe if there really had been WMD I'd feel differently, but we all know how that turned out.

First of all I want to say to ALL of those who have served our military..
THANKS FOR SERVING!!!!!! War or no war. old vetran or current vetran, GOD BLESS YOU ALL!!! I apreciate your sacrifice and respect you tremendously even if I may not agree with some of you on various posts or topics here.
Now back to the issue at hand. On the issue of teenagers brains not being fully developed until their 20's. Not going to debate that medically, but how do you explain the good that teenagers have done at young ages over the years. Many teens lied about thier age to fight honorably in WWII even stealing birth certificates of older brothers to enlist. Or on a far more current history-- the bravery and heroism of the surviving boy scouts at Little Sioux last month? those boys were around 12-15 years old.. far younger then the 17-19 high school graduates we are discussing here. I do feel that teens should be told both the pro's & cons of joining the military. But at the same time I feel that brain developed or not they are capable of making the deciscion to join the military. I feel that a teenagers actions good or bad are far more how they are raised then anything else. If any of my children told me they wanted to join the military I would have them sit down with my freinds & relatives who were in the military (yes I too had a cousin who did a tour in Iraq in 03-04) and then step back and let them decide. I would worry heavily and pray heavily for their safety but I would also be very proud of them as well. Have a good day all.

to brian:
thanks for the kind words to us veterans. i totally agree that the "good and decent kids" do have the brainpower to make up their own minds about joining the military. i talked to several people when i was 18yo. and just out of high school about joining the military. some said it was a piece of cake, and some said dont do it because you will bust your butt and its really hard to get thru it. well, i weighed all the facts i had and decided to join the navy. i was in for 4 years. after the first few days in boot camp i wanted to kill the guy who told me it was a piece of cake. IT WASNT, NOT BY A LONG SHOT. but after the first week to 2 weeks you get used to the routine and then it starts to get interesting. i traveled to florida, california,hawaii, the phillipines, japan, malaysia, hong kong, and yes vietnam. it was both intriging (sp), and scary at times. i thought to myself, why are people shooting at me? i never did anything to them. you learn real quick that its you or them. its a shame too because as most people dont realize, the enemy personnell dont want to be there any more then you do. we are no different than the enemy when it comes to normal feelings and as to why we are there. as i have said before we need the draft to get these kids in a situation that will make them men/women, or kill them trying. forget the jails, stick the punks in a boot camp enviornment. that will straighten out 99% of them. there will always be 1% or so that will never change. sorry fot the long post but i get really worked up about this subject. have a nice day.

Bring back the draft? Why is it ok for the government to make this decision for our children but not the parents? If the issue is to let children decide for themselves than doesn't bringing back the draft make this point null and void?

"There is no justice being done when their young adult is told they cannot join."

At the age of 19 they can do whatever they want in regards to their own lives, parents no longer have final say. There isn't any injustice in waiting until you're 19 and then joining if that's really what THEY want to do. If they really are adult enough to make that decision on their own, than they are adult enough to stand up to their families or anyone who disagrees with their decision. We all have difficult decisions to make that others will not agree with and we have to have the courage and strength to stand strong in our beliefs.

I don't know why people are coming down so hard on the parents. Perhaps these individuals just aren't strong enough to stand on their own two feet when they have the opportunity to do so and it's just easier to say "my parents don't want me to" when in fact, they can legally make that decision on their own and could join if they wanted.

It's a parents responsibility to give guidance and that is not wrong, no matter which side of the argument you're on. It's ultimately the responsibility of the grown child to decide for themselves what to do with that guidance.

I couldn't disagree with you more.

I was proud when my son joined the military..6 years later I'm glad he is deciding not extend his stay in the military.

Many of our sons and daughters that already serve in the military are waking up to the fact they are being used as pawns to build the military complex coffers and build an empire around the world. This is NOT the America the founders had in mind.


Pull your head out of the sand !
We currently reside in 130 out of 175 nations in the world and we have just over 700 bases world wide.
And the Bush administration has been pushing to attack Iran. A country that has not done anything to us.
And what did Iraq do to us ?
There are more terrorists in Iraq now that we have taken over their country.
Granted Saddam was ruthless but
do we take out every rouge dictator ?
No...what gives us the right ?
Why not Cuba & China while we are at it ?

And no I'm not a bleeding heart liberal..I'm a informed conservative republican that does not watch the main stream news and thinks for herself.
I would suggest other people do the same
before we wake up and find ourselves living in new world Nazi Germany.

to just a question:
unfortunately there are alot of parents who have no clue where their kids are or what they are doing. these parents cant be bothered with such trivial things. they, in most cases, dont care either. they figure let the government take care of their kids. bring back the draft and the government will take care of the kids. the kids cant just up and quit either when it gets too tough for them. these kids will be run ragged till they drop. they will learn dicipline and commitment. most will change for the better. some wont. the ones that wont make it because of being lazy or just plain rotten will end up in prison where they belong. i have no problem taking these kids and making responsible adults out of them and doing whatever it takes to get it done. quit babying these kids and teach them to grow up.

because of the job title she has is why she opted for Germany. Her unit will possibly be going to Bulgaria in the next few months and if they don't the it will be off to Afganistan next year if their commander feels they are trained and experienced enough. I guess that is all I can tell you as this is what she relays to me.

My question was not meant to debate draft/no draft. Instead, it was to point out that the topic at hand is that children should get to make this decision on their own. I was only wondering why, if that is the topic at hand, someone would suggest bringing back the draft when that would still take away the option for the child to make the decision on their own.

Now, if the topic at hand was to bring back the draft or not, then we might have some views in common that we could continue to discuss. Let me know when that topic is provided for us to give comments on and we can discuss it then. :)

P.S. I'm sure if I've misunderstood your comment, you'll let me know.

To Mother of Military Son:

You say a new world Nazi Germany? I think what you mean to say is "New Word Islamic Theocracy"

Let us do our job.

Several of you making comments said something to the effect "we should send the politicians and their kids to Iraq to fight the war on terrorism...etc.."

No matter if you are a Republican or a Democrat, please remember Senator John McCain has served in the U.S. Navy as a pilot, and it nearly cost him his life.
And that is not to mention the HORROR he went through during 5 1/2 years in a Vietnam prisoner of war camp......and he was actually given the option of going home after only 2 years....he stayed because of the unwritten law of those in prisoner of war camps the longest get to go home first....now say
what you will DAMN IT...that is courage!

Secondly, Senator John McCain has had two sons on the ground fighting the war on terrorism in Iraq...I believe, I am correct in saying one of his sons is still in the war zone in Iraq.

I could mention Barack Obama's lack of any kind of service to America.....but
we all know that...and I am going to stay on the high road by saying THANK YOU Senator John McCain for your service to your country, and that of your two sons....you father a U.S. Navy Admiral, and your grandfather, also, a U.S. Navy Admiral....that's it folks, thanks for listening...the floor is all yours!!

to joseph p. sokolovsky:
i am so sick and tired of listening to mccain about him being a pow. so what? who cares? he is doing the same thing sen. dole did. "oh i was wounded in the war thats why i have a gimpy arm". again who cares? neither one of these peoples problems have anything to do with being president. i was wounded, and i know several others who were wounded. again who cares? what about all the vets still in hospitals from vietnam, korea, ww2, and any other war we were in? who remembers them? no one. that is no one but people like me who are thankful for their service but their injuries were a chance they took when they joined the service. so quit with the bull about mccains service. it dosent wash with me. i think hes nothing but a carbon copy of bush and hes a war monger. he probably has some kind of stake in the war business like bush and cheney do. in fact if what you say is true about mccains kids being in the service, mccain probaly dosent care if they come back or not as long as he makes his money on the war. cold but true.

Hopefully, your belief that the "child" should decide also extends to the children of pro-military parents when they decide against parental pressure NOT to join the military.

To Fremonter,
regarding Senater McCain investments. They AND his wife Cindy's have already been looked at. On a Yahoo finance story that appeard earlier this year it stated that Cindy Sold two mutual funds (Euro-Pacific growth Fund, and the Capital World Growth & Income Fund), simply b/c each fund had 2 or 3 companies that did business in Sudan which has a government known for human rights abuses. A mutual fund has dozens of companies in them and I am sure the person who recomended them did not look at every company's logistical locations of where they do business. Will cindy be allowed to buy back the funds when Obama wins the election this fall? Retorhical question, I dont care if she buys them back or not. The point is with todays media trying to corinate Obama as pres now, I think that if McCain had one investment in a "wrong" place the media would be all over it like Cindy's old mutual funds. I am not saying politicians make decisions based on their investments. Al Gore is heavily invested in companies that would profit greatly in a "green" world. Thats why he is obsessed with global warming. Its as big as marketing scam as the Y2K fears getting people to buy new computers in '99. have a good day all.

To Fremonter:

Since you were so insistant on letting us know how much you do not care, I thought maybe you were not aware of what this man went through. I don't care if you are for or against the war, republican or democrat, scared or not scared, for or against McCain. This man was was tortured. I care that he was scared and his family was scared. You can say they know what they are signing up for when they sign up even though that is a very ignorant statement. They knew they were going to fight for our country, they knew they were going to travel, they knew they would be paid, they knew they would be "heros" Not for one moment do they think they are going to be tortured for YEARS! Read below and maybe you will see things differently.

He was flying his twenty-third bombing mission over North Vietnam, when his A-4E Skyhawk was shot down by a missile over Hanoi. McCain fractured both arms and a leg, and then nearly drowned, when he parachuted into Trúc Bạch Lake in Hanoi. After he regained consciousness, a crowd attacked him, crushed his shoulder with a rifle butt, and bayoneted him; he was then transported to Hanoi's main Hoa Lo Prison, nicknamed the "Hanoi Hilton".


McCain being pulled from Truc Bach Lake in Hanoi and becoming a POW on October 26, 1967.Although McCain was badly wounded, his captors refused to treat his injuries, instead beating and interrogating him to get information. Only when the North Vietnamese discovered that his father was a top admiral did they give him medical care. His status as a prisoner of war (POW) made the front pages of The New York Times and The Washington Post.



In August of 1968, a program of severe torture began on McCain. He was subjected to rope bindings and repeated beatings every two hours, at the same time as he was suffering from dysentery. Further injuries led to the beginning of a suicide attempt, which was stopped by guards. After four days, McCain made an anti-American propaganda "confession". He has always felt that his statement was dishonorable but as he would later write, "I had learned what we all learned over there: Every man has his breaking point. I had reached mine." His injuries left him permanently incapable of raising his arms above his head. He subsequently received two to three beatings per week because of his continued refusal to sign additional statements. Other American POWs were similarly tortured and maltreated in order to extract "confessions" and propaganda statements.


I CARE

to brian:
no offense but i have to ask: do you really believe the things you hear or read? do you honestly believe that the mccains will not have any interest in the wars? get real and wake up. our government is there for only one reason, and that is to make money for the "special people". the "special people" are known as the rich, the wealthy, the chosen few who buy their way thru life. wake up.

to fremonter who cares i do:
as i said before, who cares wand what does it have to do with the election? its nothing but a ploy for pity. and again i will ask you: what about all the other paople from ww2, korea, vietnam, etc. that are still in hospitals or homes? no one seems to care about them. also as i said before: when one goes into the service, one takes a chance on their lives. its just like being a cop these days. every day you go out to do your job, and you dont know if you will be coming home or maybe going to the hospital ot maybe the morgue. wake up and get with it. clear your head of all the (stuff) you have been brainwashed with throughout your life and think in reality for a change. you will not lose any sleep or modify your lifestyle in any way because of what happens in any war. (except of course if you have a relative in that war). mccain was injured, so what. bob dole was injured, so what? john kennedy was injured, so what? how many more examples do i need to list? as for me, your not impressing me one bit by saying that your concerned about the problems of mccain. go to a vets hospital ot nursing home and see what your politicians have done. theres alot of people there who were injured and will be there the rest of their lives. why arent bleeding hearts like you there helping these people? what a joke that is.

My daughter, 15, is currently enrolled in the JROTC program at her high school. She came to us last year with her class choices and said she'd like to try that class and drill. We thought that this would be a great way for her to learn about what being an American is all about and give her some discipline. Forget about one of those classes that take bottom feeders and kids who are punk hoods. This class is for the top kids, the ones who have it together, we gave them a great kid and they've made her better. She is the most respectful teen. She maintains a 3.5 and is so fit. With hopes of going career military (Air Force). I am scared for her but yet so hopeful for the future of our country. I will support her if/when she decides to join because it will be HER choice. Now as for being hard on the parents, don't. Most kids at this age are still listening to their parents, they go to the college of the parents choice and wouldn't marry someone that Mom and Dad didn't approve of. Maybe 18 is too young. Our daughter will have 4 years of the JROTC program in high school and 4 years of ROTC in college THEN start her military career. Despite their legal definition of adult they are still kids who need their parents ok in all of lifes major decisions. For those of you that have children cosidering the military, all I can say is listen, listen to them explain what they hope to get out of it, trust you raised your child right and take a bow because you have a instilled American values and a sense of pride in them. Retired and active, home and away and the future soldiers-support them all.

We all hear the news talk about '2 soldiers die in Iraq over the weekend' or '6 killed in convoy explosion...' and most think what a shame, how wrong this is... but what if your child said 'i'm thinking of going to DC for college'? Face it you'd support them going to Washington DC for an education but most of you would try to talk your kid our of joining the military. WHY? They are in more danger of loosing their lives in our nation's capitol then in a war zone. Don't take the chance of a future away from your children, all they want is for you to recognize them as an adult. Listen to them, ask questions and HEAR what they have to say.

To Fremonter Who Cares I DO:

By God, if I wasn't deployed right now and I was back home in Fremont, I'd take you to the VFW and buy you a beer! You are one of the only few who have made any sense here!

To Fremonter:

You bring up a great point about police. Would you tell your child "NO" about joining a police force? Police can get shot at, and killed. What about other dangerous jobs? Obviously being in a war is more dangerous. I don't think you people realize that not everyone who joins the military dies. I've been active duty for over three years now and have been deployed twice and I don't even know anyone who has been killed. I know hundreds of people who have been there, are there, and some on their third and fourth times. The US Army (not counting Marines, Navy, Air force, Coast Guard) alone has about 507,000 active duty troops. That is not counting National Guard or Reserves. You are looking at millions of troops rotating in and out of Iraq since 2003. And only 4,000 have been killed? Less than 1%! Has the liberal media and your king Barak Obama brainwashed you!? All of those deaths, as sad as they are, are not even combat related! That sounds like we are doing one hell of a job if you ask me. I understand that you served and I thank you for that, but your arguments are becoming more and more asinine as I return to these pages.

Wow, isn't it great that we can FREELY write our opinions in this newspaper. Yeah, you know where I am going here.
First I want to comment on the bad mouthing of Recruiters. We have a wonderful recruiter who is informed, kind, straightforward and truthful. He worked with our family for the last 2 years, recruited both of our sons and has now become a friend of our family. He not only cared about our sons, but cared enough to check in on me when they were at bootcamp and beyond. Just like every other business in our world, some are crooked and some are upright. Thanks to our Recruiter for following the Building blocks of the Marine Corp, Honor, Courage and Committment.
Secondly, you might wonder how I can send two of my sons into such a volitile situation. The answer is, it was their choice. I had a hard time with our first son signing up, and fought it all the way. It did no good for either of us. I didn't listen to him or the recruiter and needless to say, he still went to the Corps and I stayed home angry and hurt. When our second son decided that he was going to go, I made a conscious decision to research the military further, listen to others in the Corps and most importantly, listen to my son. Our whole experience this time around has been better, for both my sons and our family.
Does it hurt to have them gone, yes. Am I scared of them going to war, yes, one leaves after the first of the year for Iraq, and I am devastated. The fear of the unknown is always hard. I'm sure it is hard for my son too, but he is ready and says he is trained to the fullest. As a matter of fact, he volunteered to go.
I remember another time I was scared and faced the unknown. It was when our daughter left for college. She is our first, and didn't really know anyone and we didn't know much about the college. Alot of murders and rapes were occuring on College campuses at the time and my mind went wild. She is now a Senior in College and has done fine. She has grown into a responsible adult that can take care of herself and is doing what she dreamed of doing.
I am proud of all three of my children. They are doing what they want to do and are growing into productive citizens of the USA. They will be able to provide for themselves and give back to a world that has given so much to them.
Patriotisim is something that is learned, not just inborn. We believe in our Country and it's leaders and pray for all of them daily. Our men and women that are serving their country in what ever way they are told are also proud of the USA. Instead of trying to decide if we support the war or the people fighting, perhaps we should spend more time supporting our country and troops in prayer. This is something all can do.
Thanks to all those that are currently serving and those that have served before, even giving their lives for us. Also thanks to all the familes so greatly affected by their loved ones decisions. I am so pround of my Marines, and they are so Proud to serve our Country. Are you this proud of the job you do everyday?

To Mom of Marines:

From this Soldier to your family and your Marines, thank you.

to fremonter.
1. I do NOT believe evrything I read or see in the media or internet. I try to research when possible. Its called doing your homework.
2. That is one of the easiest arguments to make. If a person does not like a something in a debate then accuse the other person of reading lies or false information and believing it.
3. I dont doubt politicians do things that help their investments. al gore is heavily invested in companies that would benefit in the global warming crusade.
4. let me play devil's advocate and agree with you totally. Should All politicians at a national level be forced the business day before they are innaugerated to president or both sides of congress be forced to sell ALL investments out of fear of a conflict of interest? Or perhaps be allowed a selection of mutual funds? What would be your solution to the issues you bring up? Btw I agree this is off the topic of parental guidence to the military/child issue, but you brought it up.
have a good day.

to bignell:
first of all i never said that everyone who goes into the military or to a war zone is killed. get your facts straight. why are we in iraq and afganistan? dont give me "to keep us free garbage" either. its all for oil and money. if you like being there for those reasons then thats your choice. what i said was the idiots like mccain and other bleeding hearts need to look at all the vets that were killed, injured, maimed who are still having a hard time in their lives. thanks to our moron politicians and people like you who feel these morons are right, we are and will be for a long time involved in a senseless war. whats it gonna take to wake people like you up? are you and others numb from the neck up? are you and others so brainwashed into believing that we are in iraq to keep us free? wake up. think logically. iraq is another vietnam. we will pull out and all who died or were injured will have done it for nothing. again just like vietnam. you and others need to be taken to a place to be de-programmed. i know your probably (upset) but thats because you are programmed to only believe what your told to believe. remember i was in the military too. i know how it works and how full of it the politicians are. president johnson came about our ship when i was in the navy and gave a speech. i thought then like i think now, what a liar and a bs'er. he said, among other things "we are in vietnam to keep our great country free, and to spread the freedom to the people that are under dictators". what a load of doo doo. wake up. think real hard about what all this war business is about. oh yea, and get all the facts about what i have said straight before you answer.

To Bignell: I just read your July 17th post closer and see why you are making so much sense also. I will take you up on that beer when you return safe and sound:) How long are you going to be there for? I hope you and your unit stay safe and sound and my thoughts and prayers are with you.

About McCain's story. You need to do a little more research. There is a website from Vietnam Vets against McCain. They refute his story as being over dramatized. He was taken to a camp that did not beat people. He refuses to acknowledge the villager that helped save him from the water when his plane went down and that helped save him from the crowd that wanted to beat him. Do your research please....